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49ersparadise.com FORUM  |  49ers Paradise  |  49ers Draft and Free Agency Talk  |  Topic: Free agents? 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
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Author Topic: Free agents?  (Read 92524 times)
hellblazer
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1320 on: July 23, 2008, 03:42:09 AM »
Quote from: J on July 22, 2008, 03:08:37 PM
I'd welcome Allen back, but as a backup. Nolan would have to make it clear coming in that Allen has to clearly be the better LG or else he's riding the pine.

B/c of that, Allen will stay retired or a FA or whatever he is.  I can't imagine him coming back as a backup.
I don't think it would be up to Nolan if Martz didn't like him.

Nolan to Martz (offensive amateur trying to hide his ineptitude with a seasoned Pro)
"Do you want Larry Allen?"

Martz to Nolan
"No."
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twinspapa
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1321 on: July 23, 2008, 05:44:59 AM »
+ this tactic is strictly to avoid camp imo anyway.
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Cbass
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1322 on: July 23, 2008, 06:18:36 AM »
Quote from: hellblazer on July 23, 2008, 03:42:09 AM
Quote from: J on July 22, 2008, 03:08:37 PM
I'd welcome Allen back, but as a backup. Nolan would have to make it clear coming in that Allen has to clearly be the better LG or else he's riding the pine.

B/c of that, Allen will stay retired or a FA or whatever he is. I can't imagine him coming back as a backup.
I don't think it would be up to Nolan if Martz didn't like him.

Nolan to Martz (offensive amateur trying to hide his ineptitude with a seasoned Pro)
"Do you want Larry Allen?"

Martz to Nolan
"No."

Nice, that sounds about right

Thing is......I see Allen as old, old 7series BMW or a supermodel past her prime...Can he out perform what's out on the streets?
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CapitolNiners
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1323 on: July 23, 2008, 06:30:22 AM »
Dude, you just compared a man who weighs over 300 lbs and can bench press small buildings to a supermodel past her prime?  I mean...really?  LOL
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J
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1324 on: July 23, 2008, 07:03:56 AM »
hellblazer: I disagree.  Martz is not the GM or the HC.  Yes, he holds considerable sway over the offense, but he has always had his QB chosen well before TC too. But for some reason that hasn't happened here (and no, it's not b/c of the "competition"). B/c of that, if Martz had his way, he'd have chosen a starting QB by now. 

I think it's entirely up to Nolan whether Allen comes in as a starter or backup.  I think it's entirely up to Scotty whether Allen is a Niner at all.
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D-roc
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1325 on: July 23, 2008, 08:28:22 AM »
Allen averaged $4.2 million for his two seasons with the 49ers. You can bet the 49ers would not even consider paying him that much. Right now, his agent is asking the 49ers for more money than they are willing to pay him.

Adam Snyder has been at left guard during the entire offseason program. If Allen drops his asking price, the 49ers will be willing to talk with them about working a deal. Allen does not appear to be a high priority for the 49ers right now, though.

There is probably a split on the staff on what Allen's role would be if he returned. I'd guess that Warhop envisions him as a starter, while others see him as a backup. One thing is for sure: Allen does not consider himself a backup.

http://www.49ersparadise.com/cgi-bin/news/news.cgi?action=display&num=17780
« Last Edit: July 23, 2008, 08:29:57 AM by D-roc » Logged
Cbass
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1326 on: July 23, 2008, 10:23:18 AM »
Quote from: CapitolNiners on July 23, 2008, 06:30:22 AM
Dude, you just compared a man who weighs over 300 lbs and can bench press small buildings to a supermodel past her prime? I mean...really? LOL



Yeah, I caught myself saying/thinking that too - haha !  But my point was to compare something  once unattainable at a bargin...It is the allure of something once great!  I think he can play ...So is Allen at this stage of the game, better than Jeb Tab? or whoever he bumps off the roster?  

http://www.49ersparadise.com/cgi-bin/news/news.cgi?action=display&num=17780
but I don't think he should be a Starter either...We'll see what happens
   
« Last Edit: July 23, 2008, 10:31:35 AM by Cbass » Logged
D-roc
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1327 on: July 25, 2008, 01:33:11 PM »
Bryant Young's nameplate atop his empty locker has been replaced by a plate reading, "For Sale." The same goes for Melvin Oliver's old locker. Meanwhile, Larry Allen's locker remains untouched.

http://49ers.pressdemocrat.com/default.asp?item=2241157
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mcshow2
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1328 on: July 25, 2008, 03:32:36 PM »
My take (and to roll with the analogy)...   I'd rather have an older, but still solid, mercedes, than a brand new shiny saturn.    The packers got a guy that's been waiting in the wings for some time now...  they already named Rogers their starter. 

Nothing has been named on our front line.  Let Allen come back... if he sucks, cut his ass/bench him/force him to retire.

OL is a position of need for us...  LA is a hall of famer.  Let's give him a shot.
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TIM
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1329 on: July 25, 2008, 07:28:29 PM »
Allen has NOT even been to SC to work out and last year he came into camp out of shape and he played poorly for a bunch of games early on. He is not much of a pass blocker any more and who knows if he can even run block half as well as he could late last year.
If he comes in and is in good shape,I guess he would be good insurance for Baas possibly not being ready for the season opener. But could Allen even unseat Snyder? From what I hear Snyder is a much better pass blocker right now and was last year as well.If Allen came back he would want to start.Is that what we want ? Will Snyder ever get settled in and become what he can be if he always is moving around?

I think allen is retired and should stay retired unless we get into an emergency situation and we need someone like him to come in and fill a spot because of injury etc.
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KS_Niner
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1330 on: July 25, 2008, 07:49:43 PM »
TIM, you have that backwards - Allen came in out of shape in 2006 and had a great season.  Then he came back last year in great shape and sucked for the first 11 games.  But, at this point, I don't want Allen on the team as anything other than a backup / situational guy - whether he's in shape or not.  We have to move on and give our OL a chance to gel before the season starts. 

And TIM, since I know you put SO much stock in the Matts, here's a quote from last year for ya:

"The difference between Allen in 2006 and Allen in 2007 is stark. He said he currently weighs about 340 pounds. No one ever found out what he weighed last year, but it sure as heck wasn't 340 pounds. Fellow guard Justin Smiley estimated it was around 370 pounds.
Allen looked anything but spry last season. He labored through drills and spent the time immediately after practice running sprints - and I use the term "sprint" quite loosely - in an effort to lose weight. These days, he is pulling and running sweeps almost as much as Smiley. He looks five years younger."

Matt B
8-22-2007
http://www.sacbee.com/static/weblogs/49ers/archives/008063.html
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1331 on: July 25, 2008, 08:17:10 PM »
Quote from: KS_Niner on July 25, 2008, 07:49:43 PM
TIM, you have that backwards - Allen came in out of shape in 2006 and had a great season. Then he came back last year in great shape and sucked for the first 11 games.

If that is the case then we should sign him right away and make sure he gets lots of cheesecake fried in lard  ( or whatever is fattening )at every meal !
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D-roc
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1332 on: July 26, 2008, 08:18:57 AM »
I would still be surprised to see Big L.A. back unless his asking price comes down significantly & poss. not even then.  The team is ready to get younger at guard and Allen's best days are clearly behind him. 
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reddoggg
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1333 on: July 26, 2008, 12:05:29 PM »
Quote from: TIM on July 25, 2008, 08:17:10 PM
Quote from: KS_Niner on July 25, 2008, 07:49:43 PM
TIM, you have that backwards - Allen came in out of shape in 2006 and had a great season. Then he came back last year in great shape and sucked for the first 11 games.

If that is the case then we should sign him right away and make sure he gets lots of cheesecake fried in lard ( or whatever is fattening )at every meal !

Tim actually had it right in essence. LA was in fairly good shape for a man his size in 2006. Last year he skipped camp and came in looking like "Refridgerator" Perry. The only way we bring him back is if he looks much more like the 2006 version IMHO.
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TIM
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1334 on: July 26, 2008, 01:22:23 PM »
Thanks for the backup Doggg ! Everyone already knows I am always right about everything all the time but thanks anyway  Wink   Grin.

And I think it is time to move on BUT it sounds like Warhop wants LA back  (another reason to question Warhop's judgement ?).
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D-roc
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1335 on: July 26, 2008, 04:20:02 PM »
Quote from: TIM on July 26, 2008, 01:22:23 PM
Thanks for the backup Doggg ! Everyone already knows I am always right about everything all the time but thanks anyway  Wink   Grin.

And I think it is time to move on BUT it sounds like Warhop wants LA back  (another reason to question Warhop's judgement ?).

I don't think so T. SPOON Wink, I hope we go younger and let this young group (Snyder...) grow as a unit... 

That being said, your RIGHT again it has been since 75 or so you were wrong!  Or was it 72?  ADHD IS a real b****..... Smiley
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KS_Niner
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1336 on: July 26, 2008, 07:23:11 PM »
Sorry redd, but you and TIM are both wrong (once in 35 yrs ain't bad TIm, LOL).  Allen came in last year in MUCH better shape than he did in 2006.  When he started out the season so poorly, plenty of us in here were making jokes about how we wished the fat Allen had shown up instead.  Like it or not, his struggles in 2007 were not the result of being out of shape.

Its all right there in the article from Matt B.  Read it for yourself.

Or try this one about the 2007 version of Larry Allen-

"He just seems like a different person this year," fellow guard Justin Smiley said. "As far as getting up off the ground after a play, he gets up quicker. He looks better. You can just tell he put in a lot of time this offseason."

http://www.sacbee.com/100/v-print/story/340287.html
« Last Edit: July 26, 2008, 07:30:18 PM by KS_Niner » Logged
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1337 on: July 28, 2008, 12:44:41 PM »
KS: So,like I said before,we should be glad LA has not been working out and we should sign him right away and bring him in and feed him lots of fatty fried foods for the next month until the regular season starts. Get him up to about 400 pounds and he is sure to have another of his PB seasons !
Or we could go with the youth ,who actually come in and work out and show some desire to work for a job and work towards a championship.
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KS_Niner
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1338 on: July 28, 2008, 12:59:15 PM »
LOL, if I thought LA was a cheesecake away from repeating his performance in 2006, than I would go out and buy it myself!
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westcoastguy
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1339 on: July 28, 2008, 01:30:28 PM »
Not that it really matters, but KS is right.  Nolan was raving about how fit Allen looked when he arrived last year, and talked extensively about the state of the art workout gym Allen had installed in his house.  The fact is, Allen has a lot of miles on him, and it showed last season.  I agree with Tim in that it is time to see what we have in the younger players, but I still wouldn't be opposed to resigning Allen for a reasonable contract that didn't guarantee him the starting spot unless he earned it.
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TIM
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1340 on: July 28, 2008, 01:37:31 PM »
KS: I think this answer from Matt M. on his blog was probably why I had the idea in my head that Allen was bad last year because he was in bad shape when he came into camp...

QUESTION: Is the possible return of Larry Allen really a good thing for the Niners? Seems he has lost at least one step and I would think that the team would like to start getting some sort of return on the investment in Adam Snyder instead of having ride the bench for another season. (Jason)

INSTANT 49ERS: The re-signing of Larry Allen is not exactly a priority for the 49ers right now. He's asking for too much money. My guess is that maybe he comes into play if they're in need of an "emergency player." Snyder is slated to be the starter. He's better in pass protection. Allen did not take part in any of the 49ers' offseason program last year and he really struggled early in the season (coincidence?). I think they're better off sticking with what they have at this point.
 
--- On further review,Matt may have meant that Allen did not work together with his team mates on the O line during the off season and therefore started the season without the teamwork needed to play well together with his line mates?
But it sounds like Matt is saying that because he stayed home and worked out on his own that he didn't get with the program early on in the season. Can't be a loner on the O line.it is a unit !

So anyway,with that quote fresh in my mind you can see why I posted that Allen came in out of shape last year.

And you notice that Matt also states that Snyder is already a better pass blocker than Allen,so let the young guy show what he has !


And WCG,all the reports I have read so far seem to indicate that Allen would not come back to the Niners unless he knew he was going to start. I would love to have the guy come in at a reduced salary and be a backup (we have seen how injury to the O line can ruin a team). If he wins the job then good for him but he should be told he is not guaranteed to start. I still don't like the idea of Allen starting and Snyder put on hold for another year. It should be Snyder's time now ,unless he can't handle it.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2008, 01:43:07 PM by TIM » Logged
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KS_Niner
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1341 on: July 28, 2008, 02:56:46 PM »
Yeah, I could see how you might interpret that quote differently and I didn't expect / want to spend this much time on a non-issue.  Its just that I wanted to point out that Allen being in shape or not shouldn't really be a deciding factor.  I think you are right on the mark about missing offseason workouts and how that may affect the OL's ability to gel.  That's a much bigger worry to me than his weight.  He did seem to lose a step in pass protection last year, even getting several tripping calls when someone a little faster off the line got him initially.  But then again, it seemed like the entire interior offensive line had that problem, so who knows if it was just Allen screwing up or trying to make up for a blown block by someone else.  (and now Matt M keeps talking about how good Heitmann looks in pass protection drills - go figure).

I would like the 370 pound LA to come in on short yardage & goal line situations to blow open some holes, but I don't think that's the role he enivisions for himself.  I guess it would be hard to go from one of the premier OG's in the league to a situational backup role, though.  Especially since he made the PB in 2006.  I'd do it for the vet min, but I doubt the money means that much to him at this point.

Either way, I agree its time we see what Snyder can do as a starting LG.
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1342 on: July 28, 2008, 03:05:25 PM »
Quote from: KS_Niner on July 28, 2008, 02:56:46 PM
He did seem to lose a step in pass protection last year, even getting several tripping calls when someone a little faster off the line got him initially. But then again, it seemed like the entire interior offensive line had that problem, so who knows if it was just Allen screwing up or trying to make up for a blown block by someone else.

That was sort of my point earlier on,that Warhop couldn't seem to get these guys to play together. Everyone seemed to be missing assignments all over the place,game after game. To me that is either bad players or stupid players or bad coaching. I watched the team for a while and I concluded that until further notice and more information about Warhop ,that I was going to blame him for most of the chaos. I could be off base but it just seemed like a good teacher could get these guys to at least recognize a blitz by midseason.
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D-roc
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1343 on: August 01, 2008, 12:07:49 PM »
Not ready for reduced role, Lynch looks for new team

http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/story/10915441

Great player in his prime but his best days are clearly behind him. 
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dr. nick riviera
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1344 on: August 02, 2008, 12:22:19 PM »
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hojer49
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1345 on: August 02, 2008, 03:44:11 PM »
I know I'm going to get killed for this but why not try to get Favre to SF? This way we can get a 4-way competition for the starting job!

Don't know if Favre could function in the Martz offense - but what a sight it would be: Favre in red and gold!
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1346 on: August 02, 2008, 04:43:21 PM »
From KFFL...
ESPNews reports NFL commissioner Roger Goodell is expected to reinstate Green Bay Packers retired QB Brett Favre Monday, Aug. 4. Goodell is growing tired of the situation and reinstating Favre will force the two parties to speed up their discussions on which direction they will go.
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GET SIX !!!
D-roc
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1347 on: August 02, 2008, 05:08:31 PM »
Good for him enough is enough.......
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J
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1348 on: August 02, 2008, 08:52:58 PM »
 hojer: Nah. Why would you think you'd "get killed" for that question?  Roll Eyes  Btw, don't open any suspicious-looking packages.
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gridiron49
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Re: Free agents?
« Reply #1349 on: August 03, 2008, 05:22:38 AM »
Quote from: hojer49 on August 02, 2008, 03:44:11 PM
I know I'm going to get killed for this but why not try to get Favre to SF? This way we can get a 4-way competition for the starting job!

Don't know if Favre could function in the Martz offense - but what a sight it would be: Favre in red and gold!
Favre in red and gold - no thank you!

I don't think he would fit in Martz' offense and he would be way behind on the learning curve despite his centuries of wisdom but I am sick of him changing stance every moment - retired/not retired, force a trade/go to Packers camp, take the money/not take the money......  Tongue Lips sealed
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